Unlocking Potential with Dr. Karyn Edwards at the 2025 Facilitation Lab Summit
At the 2025 Facilitation Lab Summit, Dr. Karyn Edwards led an engaging and thought-provoking session that bridged the gap between coaching and facilitation. With her vast experience in both fields, Karyn helped participants explore how coaching techniques can elevate facilitation practices, encouraging a shift in mindset and perspective. Her session was not only educational but highly interactive, inviting attendees to reflect on their personal experiences and challenges.
The Power of Non-Directive Coaching
Karyn’s session began with an energetic icebreaker, setting the stage for the day’s exploration of non-directive coaching. By playing Lizzo’s “Good as Hell” and Whitney Houston’s “How Will I Know?” Karyn invited attendees to consider which song aligned more with coaching frameworks. This fun activity underscored the importance of empowering clients to discover their own answers, rather than providing prescriptive solutions. As Karyn explained, non-directive coaching encourages a space where individuals can reflect, think critically, and ultimately find solutions that resonate with their experiences.
Interactive Activities: From Worst Facilitator to Best Solutions
Karyn used practical exercises to help participants identify common challenges faced by facilitators. Attendees were asked to brainstorm and share sticky notes about the worst facilitation experiences they’ve encountered or witnessed. This activity was followed by group discussions on how these challenges could be resolved. The collective wisdom of the group sparked deep conversations about the importance of self-awareness, energy, and how facilitators can create environments that foster growth and transformation.
Key Insights: The Role of Facilitators and Coaches
One of the central themes of the session was the role of the facilitator in creating an environment conducive to learning and growth. As Karyn put it, the facilitator is responsible for setting the container, but it is up to the participants to do the work. This shift in perspective was eye-opening for many attendees, as it emphasized the importance of trust, openness, and collaboration. Karyn also stressed the idea of “letting go” of the desire to control the outcome, allowing participants the freedom to explore and contribute to the discussion without fear of judgment.
The Intersection of Coaching and Facilitation
Throughout the session, Karyn highlighted the overlap between coaching and facilitation. Both practices require a deep understanding of human dynamics, the ability to listen actively, and a willingness to adapt to the needs of the group. The session also addressed the balance between structure and flexibility, noting that while facilitators must prepare and plan, they must also be open to adjusting the course based on the group’s needs and the conversation at hand.
Karyn’s facilitation philosophy aligns with the principles of non-directive coaching, where the coach or facilitator serves as a guide rather than an expert. Her emphasis on inquiry, listening, and creating space for reflection was a powerful reminder of how these skills can be leveraged to empower others in both coaching and facilitation contexts.
Key Takeaways from Dr. Karyn Edwards’ Session:
Flexibility and Adaptability: Understanding when to stick to the agenda and when to let go, allowing the group to steer the direction of the conversation.
Empowerment through Inquiry: The importance of asking open-ended questions that evoke insight and encourage participants to explore their own solutions.
Energy and Self-Awareness: How reading and managing group energy is essential for creating a productive facilitation environment.
Non-Directive Coaching: Facilitators should adopt coaching techniques that help participants take ownership of their learning process.
Creating Safe Spaces: How facilitators and coaches must ensure a safe, supportive environment where participants feel comfortable expressing themselves.
Watch the full video below:
Transcript of Karyn’s Session:
Speaker 1 (00:04):
All right. Well, it’s great to be here and thank you all for coming back and for being here today. I am really excited to share what I’ve learned about the similarities between coaching and facilitation. And I had some people ask me some really great questions this morning about how I’m going to do that. So I’m not going to give all that away, but this will be a highly interactive session for all of you. So my first question to all of you, when you think about coaching, what is it? Right? I’ve talked to some people, say I’m a coach, and I think to myself, I wonder if we were talking the same language. So I’m going to do this through a song. We’re first going to hear Lizzo, which is my favorite song of hers, which is good as hell. What I want you to be listening for in the lyrics is what she’s describing to you. Coaching. There we go. And dancing. By the way, get up. I’m not dancing by myself. Come on. Okay. That was weak dancing you all. Come on. Okay. All right. So now we’re going to listen to the Queen, Ms. Whitney Houston and her song. How will I Know? Okay, everybody up. It’s time to dance. Okay. You cannot listen to Whitney Houston and Not Dance. Okay, here we go.
Speaker 2 (01:58):
What is this? Come on.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Okay. Alright. So think about that. Have a seat. Good job. Nice job. All of you. That really put some moves out there. I appreciate that. Okay, you can scan the QR code up there. This is Slido. Which artist song is more aligned with a coaching framework? Annette. Neck and Neck. Really? Okay. So for those of you that voted for Whitney Houston, how will I know, tell me why did you select that song as more aligned to a coaching framework? Yes. Listen,
Speaker 3 (02:46):
I feel like when she says how will I know she’s putting the onus back on the other person and kind of making them think and reflect about what would achievement or success look like.
Speaker 1 (02:56):
I love it. So you’re looking at it from a perspective that she’s the coach, which I hadn’t even thought about. So that’s a new perspective. Excellent, thank you. Oh, right here. Or I’ll let the Katie decide who’s going to go next.
Speaker 4 (03:06):
Exactly the same reason. And Whitney Houston as coach in this case, because that’s a classic coaching question I’m going to do. How will I know?
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Yeah, love
Speaker 4 (03:16):
It. It’s the follow up, the accountability.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Great, thank you. Are some other questions? Why did you pick which song you picked? I saw a few other hands who picked Lizzo? Maybe give us, what was it about Lizzo song that you decided was a coaching framework?
Speaker 5 (03:31):
I definitely did not pick Lizzo because I agree with them. Lizzo seems prescriptive, like she’s forcing her definition of what good is on the person or us. Also, Whitney’s just better and Lizzo is getting sued by a bunch of her dancers. So I don’t really trust her as an authority.
Speaker 1 (03:51):
I didn’t know that. So new information, yes,
Speaker 6 (03:53):
Counterpoint. I picked Lizzo because I think if I took it from the person who was being coached. So that’s the point of view. And it’s like if I’m feeling good as hell about myself and my day and what I’ve got ahead of me, I’m like on wings. I’m feeling really good about that. Nice. So confidence maybe could have been the one word answer.
Speaker 7 (04:17):
Great,
Speaker 1 (04:17):
Thank you.
Speaker 7 (04:18):
One more. So I chose Lizzo again from the perspective of someone being coached and it’s how do I show up?
Speaker 1 (04:25):
Nice. Okay, great. Interesting perspective. Let’s take one more and then we’ll talk about, is there a right answer here?
Speaker 8 (04:33):
Sure. I also chose Lizzo good as hell because as a coachee, I am the one that’s running the agenda and the discussion points with my coach of how I’m feeling, what I want to do, what I want to see where my path is going and my coach is there to help walk me side by side on how I see that path.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
Nice. Thank you. Thank you all. I appreciate you adding your perspectives. So my perspective was that as a coach, Whitney is asking how well I know, right? And so as a coach, my question back to her would be, how will you know if he really loves you? And by the way, is there’s some emotional suppression in that song. I just want to point out, don’t trust your feelings. No, trust your feelings. Lizzo on the other hand is being what we would call in coaching a cheerleader. And so while that can be effective in what we sometimes think of as traditional coaching, an executive coach would consider that advice giving, right? If he doesn’t love you anymore, you walk your fine ass out the door, right? That’s advice. And so non-directive coaching is working to not give advice even though it feels good. That’s a feel good song.
(05:47):
I love that song. It’s a my go me collection of playlists. And so I just wanted to describe in a way that could bring it to life for you what the differences are and sometimes how we think about what a coach does. So today in our session, and I’m hoping my slides are going to cooperate with me, we’re going to talk about how do you apply this then to facilitation. So yesterday we had some great presenters and I did not get to see the last presenter, so I didn’t get to include the information there. But you notice that Eric started us off talking about listening, that we’re connecting, we’re building bridges. And Sky talked about listening without judgment. She talked about vulnerability is cool, and she talked about metaphors, analogies and reflection. And Alyssa talked about that change happens through story that we have to state the problem and that we get to play a little bit with the problem that we’re trying to solve. And then Kathy talked about the backpack essentials of curiosity, engaging, embracing detours, and making it real. And then I noticed the session in the afternoon had some things about breaking things down into smaller steps. All of those are fundamentals of executive coaching. All of them you could see even just through the facilitation that you’ve already been through, there’s a direct connection between the skillset sets of a coach and a facilitator.
(07:14):
So I appreciate them teeing me up so well. Yesterday Sky mentioned tris and actually I’ve used this several times. And before I started working with Voltage Control, I didn’t know what I was doing, I just knew I was doing things. And so it was really nice to put a label to some of the things that I was actually already doing. So I looked it up because I was like, what does that actually mean? It’s kind of an interesting word. And so you can see there, it’s a Russian word and a loose translation is the theory of inventive problem solving. And so what we’re going to do next is we’re going to talk about how do you look at counterproductive behaviors and figure out then how can you fix those. And again, we do this a lot in coaching as well. So you’re going to have an activity.
(07:57):
By the way, anytime you see red on the screen today, there’s something for you to do in your table group. So you’re wondering what are we doing? Or you step out for a second that’s going to be your clue to come back. So individually, I want you to take two minutes and I want you to get some sticky notes in front of you. And I want you to brainstorm. Consider elements that have been present when you have either seen the worst facilitator that you’ve ever seen, or you’ve been the worst facilitator that you’ve ever experienced. And I want you to write down, and I want you to be creative. I want you to not hold back what are the things that you see in the worst facilitation? If we could get some music while we’re doing this activity, one idea or one element per sticky note and just pile ’em up there.
(08:43):
And on your flip chart in the middle of your table, so by the fact that you’re still writing, I think we’ve all seen some pretty tough sessions. Okay, so you’re going to take your flip chart and I’d love for somebody to just draw a line down the middle on the vertical. And on one side I just want you to put all of your stickies that you observed where things did go so well. Okay, on the next step on the screen is I want your team to take a look at and examine and do affinity clustering of what themes do you see? So the ones that are similar are like put ’em on top of each other, put ’em together in some kind of cluster. Okay?
(09:45):
If you haven’t already, when you have your clusters together, give them a label of some sort and then move on to question two, which is what makes these hard as a facilitator to overcome. Have a discussion at your table, grip around that. And then the third step is you need to decide what’s your top challenge and elect someone to be your Slido entrant person who’s going to do that? And I’ll share the Slido in just a minute. Okay, so head on back to your work. All right, so there are 13 tables in here. There should be 13 items entered into what is the worst case scenario that your group selected. So just one representative from your table needs to scan the QR code and enter what is the worst case scenario that your group entered. So question for you all. When you look at that list, what comes up for you? And do we have our mics? Yep. Okay, we’re right here. Oh
Speaker 9 (10:54):
Gosh, thank you. I think all of those are tied to lack of self-awareness. So our table chose energy and from my experience with energy is that we as human beings exchange energy whether or not we know it. And so as good facilitators, one of the first things that you learn, or maybe it’s what draws us into this industry, is that we can read energy and some are better than others, and that’s tied to listening and willingness to learn, be vulnerable. And so I think that all of that negative is tied to not leaning into your authenticity and knowing who you are and how to change for the better and be a better energy space for other people.
Speaker 1 (11:47):
Yeah, thank you. That was a good answer. Nice. Appreciate you for sharing that. Yeah, so as facilitators, we’re responsible to create the environment in which the learning takes place. The participants actually create the outcome. So if you learn nothing else from me today, if you remember nothing else, you job as a facilitator is to create the environment. You create the container. It’s the same thing that coaches do. We create the environment, the participant or the client does the work. Rule number one of coaching is the client does the work. Rule number one of facilitation is the audience does the work. You as a facilitator, that should make you less nervous and take a lot of weight off of your shoulders because they’re responsible for the outcome. You’re responsible to structure it and create a framework for them to work within.
(12:42):
Alright, we’re going to do part two, flip them back and forth here. By the way, I really appreciate all the work that you’re all doing. Give yourself a round of applause. Okay. Alright. So we did that. Did that. Okay, so now we have to design the fix. So from the one that you selected, I want you to ask this very specific question to your table group. What would it be like if this challenge was resolved? What would it be like in the sessions that you go to, if this challenge that you came up with was resolved, and I want you to do the sticky note activity again. Put them on the other side of your flip chart. Okay?
(13:30):
I’m going to read the rest of the instructions just so I don’t have to interrupt you as you’re working after you do step one, then I want you to, again, what’s your best rank? Those ideas that you have from best to next best, they’re all going to be great. And then I want you to vote on two solutions that you’re coming up with that you would submit into Slido. Alright, coming on back. Coming on back. So if you are the representative, Slido entrant for your team, you can enter the two solutions that your team came up with. There should be when we get done 13 line items in here. No instructions. All right, so as you look through these, and I’ll scroll a bit as we’re finishing up getting the last one or two in here, I’d love to hear what stands out to you. And again, this is what would it be like if we were able to design a fix for some of the most difficult things that happen as facilitators? Yes.
Speaker 6 (14:41):
So if in Dom’s session yesterday you heard him say one of the most important takeaways from the behavior design system is help people feel successful. And in his book, BJ names that emotion and he calls it shine. So it’s a feeling of success that both wires in the habit that you want and propels you to future action because if you’re feeling successful, you’re leaving that session and saying, oh my gosh, what else does Dr. Karen have for us? And let me tell you about the session I went to last week. So it’s the way that you feel shine, and we did have positive outcomes, but we just felt like shine and candor were the differentiators from our group. So that’s why we put it up there.
Speaker 1 (15:29):
Love it. I’m just going to make a quick tie to coaching because when people leave a coaching engagement or even a coaching session many times, that’s the energy that’s actually creating the transformation and the energy that we create as facilitators is what creates the transformation. So there’s direct links almost. You can make a direct connection to me. Thank you for your comment. I appreciate it. One more, yes, over here.
Speaker 10 (15:58):
So I really love how you’re relating the coaching work with the facilitation work, and I’d like to hear what you think the differences are and just sort of building on what you just said because it sparked a thing with me. You get to the end of the last day of a workshop and everybody’s just all jazzed up. They’re pumped up on the thing and then they leave and then that’s when the work actually begins. I assume in a coaching engagement, you’ve got a longer term, you know what the next steps every step is going to be more or less. You’ve got a plan, I guess as a coach and you should as a facilitators, we should always have a plan after the workshop, but a lot of times you get engaged to do the workshop and create some outputs of the workshop and that’s where a lot of value gets lost. So I’m curious as to what you said
Speaker 1 (16:53):
About that. Yeah, I do think there’s a difference there in terms of the kind of once and done of what can be facilitation woes, I guess I’ll say, and the impact that you have when you do small incremental meetings over time with people because there’s an accountability loop that’s built into that. The plan, I just want to go back to that the plan comes from the client, right? Again, and that might be a slight difference in facilitation because you generally maybe have some ideas of things that you’re going to be speaking about. So there’s not a full, the group gets to decide what we’re talking about today. There’s some nuances and differences in that, but there’s many more connections than there are differences. I think that that accountability loop for facilitation is actually something that we all need to make sure we’re solving for and the work that we do as well.
(17:41):
Thank you for the question. Great question. All right. Okay. I’m going to move us forward to a little bit of part two here. So this is a great book. I’m a big book slash resource person, and Claire Norman has written a book called The Transformational Coach. I also like Marsha, I can’t think of her last name, coach the person, not the problem. Marsha Reynolds. So both of these books are great. This one in particular is really emphasizing non-directive coaching. So what is non-directive coaching? Non-directive coaching is really what the ICF, the International Coaching Federation espouses, which is that the coach is not a consultant. The coach is not going to be telling you what to do. The coach is going to be creating an environment and setting up these kind of foundations in coaching sessions. So one is really important that people are whole and capable and competent and resourceful and that they have within them everything that they need and that our job as facilitators and as coaches is to help clear the cobwebs and get through the mental hurdles that we sometimes set up for ourselves.
(19:02):
We build our own prison walls, I like to say. And so our job is to help people see things from a different perspective, give them an opportunity to sit down and work and do the work in a structured, sometimes unstructured environment. So that’s number one. You have to believe that if you don’t believe as a facilitator that your group is whole and capable and competent and resourceful, you really need to check and see. Are you actually then just training because you’re not facilitating If you’re telling them how to do what they need to do, you’re either consulting, which there’s nothing wrong with that, but you just need to be clear about what it is that you’re there to do.
(19:43):
The second is that it’s an exploratory approach and it empowers the participant and the client in this case to discover their own solutions. The fact of the matter is we can never really walk in someone else’s shoes no matter how similar you are, no matter how much your life experience. I have an identical twin, so I know I blew the bingo card, so I’m the facilitator that has the identical twin. And even though my sister and I literally shared a womb, right, we are very different. And even though we grew up in the same house, I cannot necessarily know what it’s like to live in her shoes every single day. So even people that are that close. And so when we put our ideas and solutions onto a group or an individual, I like to say we’re actually stealing a little bit of their power. There’s also a bias that we can work towards with us, which is that people love their own ideas. I mean, how many of you like to be told what to do? Raise your hand. Hi. Hi. Oh yeah, we all love it. And so if we come up with our own ideas, we are much more likely to implement those ideas and take them forward and break them down into small steps and do the work.
Speaker 11 (20:58):
Do you discern a difference between the athletic coach in English, the word coach in athletics has a kind of connotation? Is there a difference between that kind of coach as you see it and the coach in this setting?
Speaker 1 (21:13):
Yeah, so the question is, is there a difference between an athletic coach and a, what I’ll call a executive coach or a workplace coach? In my opinion, yes, because coaching in sports you’re teaching, you’re putting together a structure, they’re running drills, there’s certain plays. I’m not really that into sports, so I don’t pretend like I know what I’m talking about. I sound all like woo. So there’s definitely a difference, whereas a non-directive coaching, I’m going into sessions with asking the client, what is it you want to coach on? Today I’m going into facilitation session saying the thing that we’re going to be talking about is leadership traits. This conversation can go in a million different directions and it’s going to be up to you to decide which of those directions is most important and most impactful. So while I have a framework when I’m facilitating, I’m going to go where the group goes, and it’s part of that being adaptable and letting go of having to control the outcome, which is probably the hardest part in coaching and in facilitation that we are somehow in control of what’s going to happen. I have no idea what you’re all going to do with the next activity that we do, and I hope it goes well, but it’s up to you. So it’s letting go is a big part of this. I already talked about the client does the work, and then again, we’re responsible to create the environment. Yes.
Speaker 12 (22:31):
Good morning everyone. Just to point on that letting go piece, I think one of the things, and we were talking about this at the table, is if you understand to your point coming in asking, Hey, what do you want to get out of today? Sometimes it’s important to have data in advance, especially if you’re facilitating a session. If you know, all are seeing here are are your focuses for 2025, here were the problems, here are the gaps. What do we want to focus on today related to what you said you wanted to do? That’s very critical and important and it can empower you when you get to the end and do a survey. I love yesterday there was a session where the facilitator asked, give me feedback because we’re always improving ourselves as well. So just some points there. This has been great, doctor. Thank you.
Speaker 1 (23:24):
Oh, you’re so welcome. I love what you said. So the idea that I, I’m not just going in free styling, so I’m doing my homework, I’m doing my prep work. One of the things about data is I’m just going to tweak that just a little bit. It depends. Yesterday I was talking to a group about my doctor title and there’s some times where that works for me and sometimes where that doesn’t work for me because it can be intimidating to the group where they think, oh, great, this will be an academic boring blah, blah, blah, right? Kind of thing. No offense, Eric, but that can be a perception that it comes along with that title. And so knowing that I could go in and tell you, I could tell you all the neuroscience of why coaching works, and I could come in with loads of data and research and some of you would be like, yes, let’s talk about that. That’s exciting. And others would be like, oh, right. So we started off with Lizzo and Whitney Houston instead because we’re trying to engage in a way and teach in the debrief. That’s what I espouse is teach in the debrief, have people experience something and then tell ’em what they just experienced as opposed to telling ’em what they’re going to precisely how to do things. Again, just a difference. But thank you for the question. Great question.
(24:39):
Nope, that was right. Okay, so today we’ve been following a participative agenda and we’ve been doing things like the focus has been on the conversation that we’re having within a framework. So I had ideas of what you’re going to do, right? I’m using facilitative techniques, we use tris, we’re doing some engagement activities. The role of the facilitator again is to create the environment, but I’m not walking around going, oh, that’s that idea. No, don’t put that up there. That’s not exactly what we’re doing. I’m asking you questions and you’re asking me questions and we’re the experience that you’re having and it’s a partnership. We’re in a partnership together. I’m not in coaching, it’s also a partnership just because I went and got a coaching credential and I have all this stuff. I am on equal footing with my clients, which is different. When you go to a doctor, doctor, like a doctor that can help you, you’re going to probably take their advice, excuse me, or you’re going to seek maybe a second opinion, but you’re probably going to take the medicine they prescribe or you’re probably going to think about what they wanted you to do or you’re just going to go do it.
(25:47):
That is a hierarchical relationship. The coach and the facilitator, we are an equal footing. I don’t know more than you, I don’t have your experience, I don’t have your background, but we are sharing an environment together. So what I’d like you to do is stand up and I want you to find a partner, someone that you haven’t met, and I want you to decide how have we been demonstrating a participative agenda so far today in this session? Okay. Find somebody you haven’t met. Okay. I’d love just a few shares maybe from a table in the back that hasn’t shared yet today. What were some of the things that you came up with?
Speaker 13 (26:36):
So me and Harry were together and we were talking about that you set the stage from the beginning, you set the environment because I asked Harry, well, how do you create an environment? And then we talked about it and it was apparent you set the stage from the first of the training today that we were going to do the word, you aren’t going to do it. You’re not going to give us your list. And then we come up with our own list. That’s boring as heck, but you’re going to leave us alone and you’re going to turn us loose and we’re going to go save the world. And it was fun. Good. Anyway,
Speaker 1 (27:10):
Thank you for that. Appreciate it. Couple comments over here.
Speaker 14 (27:15):
So a meta question came up for me because we were talking about the dissonance between the two questions. What is the outcome versus what are the solutions? And then I saw you come over and it was like figure it out kind of thing. And so we were talking about creating this environment and does the environment look like a pool or rails? And I wonder if there’s matching the situation to the creation of that environment. Do you go into a coaching session where it’s like, okay, well declare your outcome and let’s see if we can get there versus wow, let’s just open up the floor and let it spill out. I dunno.
Speaker 1 (28:04):
That’s a good question. Yeah, it’s in coaching us a little bit of both. So there is a framework. So you’re asking the client what do they want to coach on? You’re asking them what they want to walk away with at the end of the time together that they don’t currently have. And you’re asking them, how will we know when we’ve gotten there? So those are just three very common questions at the beginning of a coaching session. And those are similar questions I ask myself when I’m facilitating, what’s the topic, what’s the intended outcome? Where does the customer, because we all, even though we don’t have a boss, we do have a boss. All the customers we work with are bosses and how are we going to know when we got there? And then the flexibility is if in a session something has drastically changed. We started off today talking about the differences on what’s working and what’s not working in facilitation, but I’ve noticed a shift and now we’re starting to talk more about coaching and how do we apply this practice and you just throw it out there and you give it back to the group.
(29:03):
So I’ve noticed a shift. We want to still continue on this topic that we originally were slated for. Do we want to shift over and really spend a little bit more time on this? What’s most important to all of you today? That’s how you hand it. You just adapt and flex in the moment. And you do have a structure and a framework that you’re working within and a way in which you’re setting up for people to feel safe that we can do that. We can adjust if we need to. And as a facilitator, that’s part of your role. Does that answer your question?
Speaker 14 (29:30):
Sure.
Speaker 1 (29:32):
Maybe not.
Speaker 14 (29:33):
I’m not sure if I had an answer.
Speaker 1 (29:36):
Okay, well good. Yeah. But how much direction you give to when people doing activities, that’s a choice. Some people are very linear and they want to know they’re doing it right as opposed to there really isn’t a right way to do things. We’re trying to learn and have an experience. So you want to give them that freedom.
Speaker 15 (29:54):
So in our conversation, we got a little tripped up on the word agenda because we’re like, well, she kind of mapped out an arc that we’re following. So from that perspective, the road was laid and we’re building the content of the road perhaps. So that was one conclusion, which is, well actually we didn’t really wrote on the road, but the road was already there. But then we also saw, well, maybe the question is really have we demonstrated techniques of how we could build a Jenna that’s not fully fleshed out? So we sort of saw two different questions, two different potential meanings in the question.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Yeah, I love that. Yeah, because in my mind, I have a certain timing that I’m sticking to and there’s certain things I want to get through. But my first slide, the agenda of everything we’re going to do and how it’s all timed out and mapped out, it’s not that specific. Again, it depends on what your goal is, what you’re trying to accomplish. Back here
Speaker 16 (30:57):
A little bit following up on the outcomes that maybe you were talking about earlier, Jacqueline and I had a conversation around you saying letting go of the outcomes and kind of a little bit of a debate. Do you mean letting go of outcomes or letting go of the outcome that you had in mind? In my world, I have to drive outcomes through co-creation participation as a product manager in software, I can’t just facilitate yay. And then nothing actually happens. The outcomes out of facilitation, whether that’s a roadmap, whether that’s a solution that’s technical, whether that is a new idea. So I’m kind of curious, did we read that right? Can you a little bit explore more on the outcomes and exactly what you meant?
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Yeah, so I would argue that there’s different types of facilitation. So most of the facilitation that I do is leadership. So if you’re in technology or doing scrum or those kinds of things, and there’s certain, and it’s not like I get to walk into a company and go, oh, that was fun, but there’s really nothing that got accomplished, right? There has to be something. Same thing with coaching. There has to be a change. There has to be a shift. The letting go of it is the feeling that you are responsible for it. The group is responsible for what actually gets created. That’s the outcome that I’m talking about. I can’t control what you experienced today. I can’t control what you walk away with. All I can do is set up the environment and have a structure of things that we’re going to be doing. But if it shifts, I also have to be adaptable and flexible to move with that. So I know that in organizations, especially if you work within organizations, I do too, but you have to somehow prove your ROI of the work that you’re doing then taking all these people away and you’re spending all this time. And I think that that’s important. But I guess I would say it’s letting go of the fact that you have to walk out with something concrete that everybody is going to go do next. That’s not necessarily the outcome that is in every session, but it could be in some, right? It could be in some,
Speaker 4 (33:13):
I love that you gave the name non-directive coaching because that’s my coaching background and it’s people who have more directive coaching styles. It’s just like how does that, so could we give a name to different kinds of facilitation, more directive and more, yeah, I mean rather than trying to figure out which one is right or
Speaker 1 (33:36):
Yeah, I, so I think that, like I said to me, there’s different types. There’s different flavors for what you’re trying to accomplish. And similarly, when I’m a coach, I don’t always do peer non-directive coaching. There’s sometimes when people haven’t heard of something or they just don’t know or about a resource or something, and I will offer it to them and say, something’s coming up for me that might be interesting to you. Would it be all right if I shared it? So I’m asking permission before I’m giving advice or resources or what have you. Most of the time people say yes because polite and they’re not going to say no, but I think it is using those things like salt and pepper, right? Not if you over season things with too much of your ideas, it doesn’t go well. And people then start depending on you as a facilitator or a coach to fix everything as opposed to, again, rule number one is, oh, you forgot rule number one. Yeah, you do the work, the group does the work. Your question,
Speaker 17 (34:44):
Just want to say one quick note. Thank you for one of the lines you said was teach in the debrief, and I thought that was particularly helpful, so thank you for letting us steal that from you. But the other thing that I’d maybe offer to the group is the concept that I think I also use this as a norm when I’m facilitating, but I say the phrase, the smartest person in the room is the room. And I think that helps continue to create a space for, I didn’t create that by the way, so you can steal that, but the smartest person in the room is the room and kind of explaining like we are collaborating together. We are co-creating together. And so I love what you said, teaching the debrief and using that same methodology, and I think that’s what you helped us participate in this morning and we’ve been doing it all day yesterday, is this idea that we’re co-creating together. So thank you.
Speaker 1 (35:31):
Yeah, I’m going to steal that back in return. Absolutely. I think she had a question over here too, if we can get her a mic. Yeah, go ahead Kathy.
Speaker 7 (35:38):
I didn’t have a question more than a comment, but when I was talking to Walter over there, we appreciated the non-directive coaching and whoever said smartest person in the room is the room. We felt that in our working with our tables so appreciated. You kind of gave that framework, but we were able to work together to determine what direction it was really going to go. And so how I’m thinking about how would I bring that back into my world also in the delivery space is making sure that space is such that yes, we have an outcome we’re driving to, but the answer sits with the team that’s working on it. So making sure they have that space to kind of do what we did today, kind of set the direction.
Speaker 1 (36:19):
Yeah, I love that the facilitator isn’t the expert. They don’t have all the answers. I want to make sure we get to this woman in purple here.
Speaker 18 (36:26):
Thanks. Yeah. Building off of some of the other comments, I think it’s useful to think of these things as different tools, different approaches that exist on a spectrum. And when we understand the different ways that they can be used, we can then align those distinctions to the purpose. Kind of thinking back to one of the early comments about, well, what if I am responsible for the outcome or a conversation we were having? Well, what if you’re the team lead and the facilitator? So understanding is this a coaching moment, is it a mentorship moment, is it a management moment? I’m actually just communicating, telling the story about the thing that’s already been decided so that we can be intentional about how we’re approaching whatever that interaction that we’re having, again in the facilitation, this a purpose and a moment where full participatory agenda makes sense and works for everyone. Or being able to use that dial as a spectrum. How much do I need to direct? How much to leave it open? But just having the full range of those possibilities available to us.
Speaker 1 (37:26):
Yeah. Isn’t it nice to have options, right? Yeah. Thank you for adding that. Oh, up here. Yeah.
Speaker 19 (37:35):
I have a question. So I’m watching, I’m participating, but I’m watching the pattern of why we did this session and that’s what happens when you present to facilitators, right? We’re going to be watching the technique as much as we are a part of it. I’ve heard some comments that there’s different levels of experience in the room as facilitators. So some people might say, well, I already know what a facilitator role is. I already know that the audience or the group, the room is doing the work. Is that something just because all human beings and we’re not perfect, is that something like gravity that we have to watch out for because facilitators are going to get a lot of attention that we’re naturally going to keep leaning in towards we have the knowledge because experienced or blah, blah, blah. How do you answer the people that have been like, Hey, I’ve been a facilitator for a long time. I’m fascinated by that perspective. Is this something we have to watch out for?
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Yeah, I think our own ego, for lack of a better word, is definitely something we always need to watch out for. And our propensity, if you’ve always been the expert or if you know a lot about the group or the room that you’re in, it’s challenging to not consult. What I would say is that if you learn the skills of non-directive coaching, you can turn that on when it makes sense and you can turn it off when it doesn’t make sense. But I think the experience of the facilitator and experience of the coach for that matter, I think you always have to put yourself in the learner’s mindset to say, I don’t have it all figured out. I don’t stand up here telling you I know every single thing about coaching and facilitation. This is just the experience I want to share with you. So I think that’s my answer to that is always be watching for that and always keep the learners’ mindset.
Speaker 20 (39:29):
If I could say something about that. The mic runner for us, we explicitly tell our participants, you guys are the subject matter experts. We work for a healthcare company. None of us are in healthcare. You guys are the subject matter experts on laundry spend. We are the subject matter experts in facilitation. And we tell them, you guys are the superheroes, we are the guys in the chair, and we run through action items with them at the end of the meeting. But once that happens, goodbye, they’ve asked us for 30 day follow-up meetings for them. But at least for our facilitation, once we end this session, it’s up to them. I hope that’s helpful.
Speaker 1 (40:08):
Very helpful. Oh, one more and then two more and then I’m going to move us forward.
Speaker 21 (40:14):
Thank you for this experience. I’m going to verbally drift towards the question. There’s one here, I’ll get to it. I promise. You talked a lot about coaching, coaching and facilitation, and I think there’s also some nuance between facilitation and consulting as we’ve started to allude to. I think oftentimes in my experience, people, my clients hire a facilitator, but they expect a consultant, if that makes sense. So even though we bring that process neutrality, there’s always questions that are veering into that subject matter expertise. I personally am comfortable having that neutrality. However, one of the things we talked about at our table was that as facilitators, we often arrive in a spirit of service to other people in the room. And I think this is a room where you say empathy and compassion in humans, we’re humans and we nod because we respond to people in that sort of way. So double clicking way into the room, not the client conversation, but you’re in the room and you have those participants who want you to be the expert. They want you to tell them how to do something even though you believe they’ve got it in them. I’m just curious what tips or tools you would offer in terms of how do you help empower people in the room to believe it in themselves if they don’t have that already?
Speaker 1 (41:35):
Yeah, I love that question. I love the drifting to the question too. I’m going to steal that as well. My mind just immediately clicked into coaching because I have coaching clients too that will tell me what to do. I don’t want to think about it. Just tell me what to do. And so the way that I approach that is I say, well, there are ideas that I’ve come up with. We are all smart people. We all have had different experiences and been exposed to things. And I’ll just say, I have a few things I’ve come up for me. If you’re interested, I’d be happy to share those with you. And then I’ll serve ’em up on a platter, like three things. One thing that’s come up for me is this. The next thing that’s come up for me is that, and this final idea, you don’t have to do anything with any of them, but that’s the way I handle it, is I just put ’em out there is, yeah, I have ideas and things like that. That doesn’t mean they’ll work here, because what happens is what the trap is, is you, especially if I don’t work in the company, I put my thoughts out there, well, that won’t work here because you don’t know anything about manufacturing corn syrup, right? Well, no, I don’t. And so if you serve it up in such a way that people can say, okay, she’s giving us her ideas, that doesn’t, I may have to tweak it or I may not like it at all. That’s the way I approach that situation. Oh, okay. Go ahead.
Speaker 22 (42:56):
I would add to that too, in the facilitation setting, when someone asks me a question as if I’m the expert, I always say I might want to take a pass at that in a moment, but first I would like to put it out there to the group and let’s hear from
Speaker 1 (43:11):
The
Speaker 22 (43:11):
Wisdom and the brilliance and the expertise from the group first.
Speaker 1 (43:15):
Yeah, I love that too. Yeah, throwing it out to the group, the collective, absolutely.
Speaker 4 (43:21):
This is more of an answer than a question, but it’s a useful metaphor that one of my coaches used in certification, which was, I’m going to take my coaching hat off and put my consulting hat on right now and tell you what I might know about this, and then I’m going to take my consulting hat off and put my coaching hat back on. It just helps to keep it clear. Yeah,
Speaker 1 (43:40):
Absolutely. And
Speaker 4 (43:41):
It could be true, the directive coach too. I’m going to be a directive coach here. I’m going to be a nondirective.
Speaker 1 (43:45):
I like that too. I forgot what I was going to say. I’ll come back. Alright, maybe one more and then we’re going to wrap us up here.
Speaker 7 (43:55):
I was going to say, I loved how you offered out your ideas. I borrowed something, I borrowed something from a coach I have, and sometimes when I’m talking to her, I’m like, I’m really kind of stuck. Not sure where to go with this. Let’s go on a shopping trip. So I’m going to show you what the store has. You have to tell me what direction you want to go, what’s going to work for you, your or your situation.
Speaker 1 (44:15):
But
Speaker 7 (44:15):
Oftentimes we find ourselves on a shopping trip.
Speaker 1 (44:18):
Yeah. Another couple quick questions I can tell you back for facilitating and when somebody asks me for my opinion, I’ll say things like, well, what’s most meaningful or important to you? What would it be like if you were able to solve that? So I think throwing it back, trying to throw it back as much as you can to the room versus what you alluded to, and I didn’t get your name but is now I’m the expert, right? And you want to just watch how many times you put yourself in that position if you’re truly trying to embody the structure that we’ve talked about today. Well, my timer is timing down on me here. So a couple superpowers. Okay, superpowers that I know you all have. And that coaching really espouses, which is first one is listening. We listen on three levels as a coach, we listen for the facts, we listen for the emotions, and we listen for what’s not being said.
(45:18):
So when Whitney Houston was Kooning to us this morning, how will I know what were the emotions that are part of that song? If you had to just shout a couple out. Vulnerable, angst, vulnerability, despair. Despair, uncertainty, uncertainty, right? So there’s emotions behind the words that people share. There’s also connecting the dots. If someone is sharing something with you and it’s becoming a theme, you say, there’s a couple of dots I’m trying to connect here. Let me just ask you if this resonates and correct me with whatever doesn’t. So a lot of it’s in how you position when you are going to make a statement as a coach and then always follow up with or facilitator it. Did I understand that correctly or what’s your reaction to that as I share that with you? So these are just techniques and things that we use when we’re trying to understand and listen. The other thing is to create space and silence. Silence is underused in our world today, and I’m always amazed when I just pause and let people think that more and more comes out. And you notice that today people ping pong off each other and ideas get grown from that. My advice to any leader, including myself, is talk less and talk less. If I ever write a book, that’s probably going to be the title. So nobody gets to steal it.
(46:50):
So the more you talk, the less other. You create less space for other people to be with their own ideas. So short statements, short questions brief, and then mirror neurons. Who’s heard of a mirror neuron? What’s a mirror neuron?
Speaker 20 (47:10):
It’s when Well, oh gosh, now,
Speaker 1 (47:12):
Oh, on the spot Could help,
Speaker 20 (47:14):
Isn’t it? When it fires in both people at the same time, or is that totally off?
Speaker 1 (47:20):
That’s close. Mirror neurons. Stick to
Speaker 20 (47:24):
Mic running.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
It’s okay.
Speaker 18 (47:29):
I think it’s when the same neurons fire in your brain when you see someone else doing it as if you were doing it yourself. Is that correct?
Speaker 1 (47:36):
That’s close as well. Yep. You are very scientific. Alright, so it’s the idea that when we, so I want you to, whoever you’re sitting across from, mirror their body language real quick. Pick somebody and just do the exact same thing.
(48:02):
Okay? What that does is it instantly creates comfort. It instantly creates comfort. So when you sit down next to someone, if you want to create a comfortable environment, mirror them. If you’re talking to someone with their language, if somebody says to me, gosh, I’m really frustrated with this situation. I don’t say, oh, it sounds like you’re super annoyed with that. I say, tell me more about what you’re frustrated about. I use the exact language because it’s comfortable. It’s their language. Annoyance and frustration could mean two different things to someone. So mirror language, use people’s words when they share with you. And our second superpower is inquiry. So the process of asking questions, questions that evoke insight, short, brief questions, they usually start with what or how. And then I’ll give you the magical question too, which is, if you woke up tomorrow and this situation was all resolved, what would be different? How would that have happened? What steps would you have taken? Because it forces us into future thinking versus our challenges right here, right now, which we can get kind of mired down in. And then always, where we talked about this extensively is avoid leading questions, which it sounds like, wouldn’t it be great if you just tried to do this? That’s a leading question. Versus what might you try?
(49:31):
So starting questions with what or how. There’s all kinds of books out there on questions that you can use. But those are two superpowers. So I, I’m going to end with, we’re not unfortunately going to run out of time for this part, but I want to ask you, what were your key insights from today? In coaching, we always ask, what did you learn about yourself? What are you taking away with you? And what type of support might you need? So as you end your sessions in facilitation, I invite you to try on some of these questions. What small experiments might you make? And the last question that I always ask is, what else do you need from our time together today to feel complete? What else do you need from our time together today to feel complete? So in my last question to all of you is, this is a reflective question, what will you use from our session today immediately? So take a few minutes and jot that down. And I thank you so much for your time and attention today.
Dr. Karyn Edwards’ session was a powerful reminder of the synergies between coaching and facilitation. By blending non-directive coaching with facilitation techniques, she empowered participants to embrace a more reflective, adaptable approach to their work. Her dynamic, engaging session left everyone inspired to incorporate new insights into their own facilitation practices.
